This may sound harsh, but I think this sort of 'pro life' ammendment is just a sham, it in reality, as opposed to in words, does mostly nothing. This is becuase what happens with it is simply no federal funds for a single sort or set of procedures. fine, what the providers do is get the profit from doign OTHER fed funded thigns, like counselling or health exams, check ups for generla health of women, pap smears, and so on, and then let the abortion done be a free added thing.

The ONLY way such an ammednment would be worthty of real praise is if it defunded any legal entity entirely that did any abortions at all. That is, no fed funds for anythign if you choose doing abortions. Unless it does that it becomes just one more bait and switch sheell game. It might make us FEEL better to see such an ammendment, but in reality it is a meaningless gesture.

Richard

THis is great news. Actually, I think it is significant news. The People's Democratic Socialist Worker's Party may have awakened a sleeping giant. It is a good thing to have such a giant making a stand to stop the funding of infanticide with tax money.

People must be praying and possibly even repenting for and confsssing the sins of this nation.

I am encouraged by some of the things that are happening. The other thing that I think is significant is the "Oath Keepers" movement among the military. (Google that if you haven't seen anything about it. The news is totally ignoring it.)

This is great news.

We need to increase our efforts.

Pray. Fast. Repent. (repeat untill you hear the trumpet)

jim

I know the far lonie left is angry over this one, but theri reaction as often is the case is emotion based rather than strictly logical. This bill does nothign except in regard to fundign DIRECTLY abortions, but it retains funding for abortion providers. So the provider simply does some accounting tricks and uses the fed money 'for' other thigns, things they would be doing anyways, thus freeing up what would have been spent in cost to provide the abortions - the rule changes nothign but accounting methods in practice, unless the ONLY thing a provider does is abortions, they will just work around the rule.

So the 'Woman's Clinic" changes things, and now gives free abortions, but requires the patient to get a FULL PHYSICLA AND CHECK UP AND FULL RANGE OF LAB TESTS FIRST. tHESE, NOT BEING DIRECTLY ABORTION RELATED, CAN BE PAID FOR BY FEDERAL FUNDS.

Please don't misunderstnad me here, IF I could vote on this I would gladly vote for it, it is a good gesture, but in the real world it will have almost nil effect on the abortion industry.  Their reaction is out of line with the relaity of what the ammendment actually does, as is the glee over its passing if it does [as I write I have not heard one way or the other]. Because abortion PROVIDERS can still get federal funds the net effect is symbolic, grnated a good symbolic thing if it passes, but not much more than that.

I see the bill passed the house 220 to 215.

No mention of Stupak-Pitts.

220-215 is a good sign.  THat's very close.

Now onto the Senate.

Time to melt some phone lines.

IF the ammendment remains after conference, highly unlikely as the radicals have promised their crew it will not, then it might be used to justify no mandate to cover abortion in any private plans as well.

Some abortion mills do have problems financially now, this is true. But this has happened because of one thign, lower use and changes paid. Rearrangment of revnue streaming is not that hard to do, once you set about doing it and reimage your whole business model. That is, once one stops thinking of what one makes on specific procedures and thinks of overall income. With abortion the procedure itself is rather inexpensive, so in isolation a great profit maker at just about any cost.

The real world effect would be greater if abortion were treated as any medical procedure with MALPRACTICE protections in place, and so on, which would raise insurance costs to those compatible with other 'medical' procedures. Today abortion provision is the largest basicly unregualted system we have, it is easier to get an abortion or open a place to do them than to get one's ears pierced.

I know I am in a minority on this with both sides of the issue, but I see the worry on the left and glee on the right as both in the long term economicly misplaced and unmerited. Yes, any restriction on abortions is a GOOD THING ITSELF, we can be and should be glad it is there, but I think both sides have grossly overestimated the real world value of this ammendment.

Richard;

Have you seen this?

By RICARDO ALONSO-ZALDIVAR

Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) - The glow from a health care triumph faded quickly for President Barack Obama on Sunday as Democrats realized the bill they fought so hard to pass in the House has nowhere to go in the Senate.

Speaking from the Rose Garden about 14 hours after the late Saturday vote, Obama urged senators to be like runners on a relay team and ``take the baton and bring this effort to the finish line on behalf of the American people.''

The problem is that the Senate won't run with it. The government health insurance plan included in the House bill is unacceptable to a few Democratic moderates who hold the balance of power in the Senate.

If a government plan is part of the deal, ``as a matter of conscience, I will not allow this bill to come to a final vote,'' said Sen. Joe Lieberman, the Connecticut independent whose vote Democrats need to overcome GOP filibusters.

``The House bill is dead on arrival in the Senate,'' Sen. Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., said dismissively.

Democrats did not line up to challenge him. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., has yet to schedule floor debate and hinted last week that senators may not be able to finish health care this year.

It looks like some folks in the house and senate may be trying to keep their phony-baloney jobs. Harry Reid is facing some tough opposition here in Nevada and won't want to alienate any moderates.

But for the moment, it looks like the government takeover of healthcare is dead. (HOOO_ rah!) The People's Democratic Socialist Worker's Party will have to conjure up another specter next year and that's an election year so, if reasonable people can keep the pressure up then "health care reform" might actually morph into something reasonable and practical.

Wouldn't that be swell?

jim

Here we radically disagree, for I do not think the bill is at all either morally or socially tolerable even with these two ammedments. The basic moral cause against this bill is that it is theft from the future  and will actually serve to degrade the provision of needed care to people. because of basic economic reality being ignored it is UNHEALTHY for people, it will in the end do the exact opposite of what it promises to do, and it cnanot in any way avoid that effect. It is precisely the mroal ground being here, that the bill will have a grossly immoral general effect of reducing delivery and raisng cost of health care provision, that I oppose the whole thing.

That is also why I call the anti-abortion language here fraud and a scam in the end. Sure, it is a temporary political put down of an abortion praising agenda, but the effect overall is cosmetic. If this was not so Pelosi and company would never have let it go to the floor int he first place. She know what some liberals refused to see, that in the end liberal judges would slap it down [prpbabl;y already arranged] or it would not get past the senate, but would elave her with a bill that had alreayd got the momentum of beign passed once.

Now as someone who is strongly pro life I am glad to see this pass, but I refuse to overestimate its actual effect. While, for example, now the cash cow is abortions, it is easy to shift that to mandated exams and so on for all who will get them almost free. What now brings in little, because little done, will simply become universal standard practice in adjusting the cash flow. Sure the one procedure is not funded, but then you just add several funded procedures to doing the one unfunded one, and make up the loss.