1. Do I understand correctly that you receive exactly the same text in the error message that is displayed when you attempt an HDOS boot from either the soft-sectored drive or the hard-sectored drive?

   Yes - almost. 

   With one SS disk it is exactly the same error message

   Error ?01 Unable to Mount System Disk. Boot aborted. Will restart. 

   System pauses for 30 seconds then reboots. 

   With another SS I get that error message BUT the system hangs and the HD (H-88-1 controlled disk drive SY0) activates but does not spin up.

   With another SS disk I get

   Error ?02 Fatal System Error (don't know if this disk has system dvd, etc.)

   I  do not get the Action Boot message with any of the Heath issued disks (HS) System Volume 1 or the System Update which is supposed to be the disks that you start with as explained in the instructions.

All of the above is a clean cold boot after powering down for 15 seconds - get random results otherwise as stuff stays in memory.

2. After you receive the error message, are you returned to the monitor prompt or does the system hang at that point? 

   See above.

3. There are four jumpers associated with the monitor ROM (U518) and the secondary address decoder (U516). These are either JJ505, JJ506, JJ507, and JJ508 on older units; or JJ504, JJ505, JJ506, and JJ507 on newer units. Each jumper set will be silkscreened on the board zero, one, or the letter B. Please let me know the current jumper settings for your four JJ jumpers.

    I have the "newer" H89 (H89A I think - Has JJ501, 502 and 503 in center of MB and 504, 505, 506 & 507 on the left under the 16K expansion)  Also has the Monitor 90 ROM.

   JJ 504, 506 & 507 are at 1)  JJ505 has a jumper to pin 14 of P508 as per Monitor 90 ROM installation instructions.

4. Locate the eight-section DIP switch SW501. Note that the switches on SW501 are numbered from zero to seven. Also note that each of the eight switches can be configured as either zero or one. Please let me know the current configuration of each of your eight switches on SW501.

   JJ501 - is -   0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1, 0, 0

5. Does your H-89 live in an area where humidity is fairly high?

Humidity is not what I would call high or excessive.

The thing that stumps me is that it boots up great in CPM from either drive and if I type C(heck) instead of B(oot) it checks the CRC of all of the sectors on the HD or SS disks from the HDOS prompt.

If it makes any difference - several years ago I had put in two 640K 3-1/2 disk drives in place of the 96 TPI 5 in SS DD disk. this worked great and used it this way for about a year. When I tried to get it going last week thought these were the problem and took out.  For some reason even though I can use the OLD 96 TPI SS DD I can only get one of these to work. With the second one in then neither work - same for two 96 TPI SS 5 in DD

Thanks for help

1. With no diskettes inserted, power up to an H: prompt. Insert an appropriate HDOS boot diskette into each drive. At the H: prompt, issue the command MOUNT SY0:. Then issue the command MOUNT SY1:.

When I hit the M I get a beep and nothing else on the screen. 

Only B -Boot, H - Help, C - Convert, V - View, I - In, O - Out, T - Test memory, R - Radix, P Program Counter, S - Substitute, and G Go   do anything.

2. Power off. Temporarily set SW501, section 4 from 0 to 1. Power up and attempt an HDOS boot from a soft-sectored system diskette.

Boots from the 89-37 instead of 88-18.  All symptoms remain.

3. Locate the HDOS ROM at U520. Please let me know the part number silkscreened on this chip. This part number will be in the format "444-xx-y".

   444-19

Removed and re-inserted all chips on the 89-37 (except the WD-1797-02 - don't want to mess it up)  on a ESD mat.

All symptoms remain.

I have saved all of the parts as I upgraded - is it worth going back to the "original" H-89A (schematics confirm that is what I have.) Some of the parts don't have the heath designation though e.g. 557 and 558.

GOT IT FIXED!

Thanks for the help. 

While cleaning U520 (HDOS ROM) I noticed that the pins on U523 and U525 (Floppy RAM) were black (real black).  After trying with just the cleaning to U520 cleaned U523 & 525, tested and it works. 

It appears that HDOS uses the floppy ram as a R/W buffer for the floppy (assumption) and CP/M does not, thus the fact that CP/M worked and HDOS did not.

Has any member of this group read the various PROM's and stored the data so that the PROM's could be re-burnt?  I sure hope so.  I sure don't know how else we could replace any.

Thanks for all of the help, now to figure out what is on all of these disks and how to load HDOS-3 onto a disk.  Guess I will have to use a modem program.

Rich

Back again,

The  2114s at U523 and U525 are made by Texas Instruments.  They looked like a silver set put away for several years.

In confirming everything works properly I tried several different disks.  Some that should boot up don't and only a few that should do.  I remembered that alignment was much more critical for HDOS than CP/M so I tried to make some "new" disks, BUT when I try to run INIT the system locks up after the message (to the effect of ) "dismounting all disks...." When I tried "Dismount SY0:" it worked but could only put back in the boot disk.  When I tried "mount SY1: it seems to lock up the system or I am not using it right. 

How do I read a disk that I can't boot?  The problem is that none of the Original Zenith distribution disks or their copies (30 years old) will boot.

Can you give me a few commands that should work?

Is there still something else broke?  By the way the pull-up resistor pack for the HS disk drive (H-17-1) is missing could this be the cause of the Original OS disks not booting up (but ones that I made years ago do boot up which confuses me).

I have one other HDOS ROM -  444-62 (early 1980 Zenith - not Heath kit) , If I put it in will I be able to boot up on the 88-17 and confirm that the HDOS rom is good/no-good?

Now I remember why I quit using HDOS.

Only the last drive on a cable should have the termination resistor pack. So if two are on the SAME cable and interface. The one in the middle is not terminated.

36ms and still failing. Sounds like the drives lubrication is dried out. Do you know the drives manufacturer? I still have manuals for a few of the drives used by H/Z and think I still have a few buried somewhere. Ah the good old Clunk of the Heads Loading!

The drives that at least boot up repeatedly in CP/M (and one SS and one HS disk in HDOS only) is one of the original and one I bought a few months later - SIEMENS FDD 100-5 - looks exactly like H-17-1.  These report that they fail the seek time at the first step 36 ms. 

I also have a Tandon TM100-2A, 48 TPI DSR  (which came with the Z-100 has the small finger flap to open - not full door).  Originally there were two in the Z-100, when I added the Hard Drive to the Z-100 I moved one to the H-89 and I know it worked!, but not now.  I can get it to format, sysgen, etc. then when I try to boot or read I get bdos errors. There is still one in the Z-100 which works but I don't want to mess with the Z-100 as it is working!

I remember (I think) of problems when trying to format disks on the H-89 that were previously used on the Z-100 or vice versa.  Could this be part of the problem?  As I remember you had to manually de-gauss the disks to get them to work on the other.  Or should we clear up the seek time problem first? Why are the diagnostic disks that came with the 89-7 upgrade read but not some of the others?

 I have swapped U19/20 (the 7416 drivers on the 89-370) with U21/22 and the symptoms are the same. I have jumpers at J4, J5, & J6 with a cable from P3 to those drives set up as SS. Have never used a seperate cable from P4.

Thanks for your continued assistance.

Rich

Hi, Rich.

You can clean the heads of the FDDs with rubbing alcohol on a cotton swab. Brian might be able to tell you more about lubricating the drives. I've never found that to be required.

If head cleaning doesn't correct the prolonged seek times, the problem is most likely with the disks themselves. If the HDOS disks were accidentally written by the Z-100, you're out of luck.

Regardless, I suggest that you devote some time to cleaning all of the socketed chips in the H-89. This might sound daunting, but I used to complete the task within the course of watching a baseball game -- about three hours.

Double-sided double density 48 TPI disks are still available, and show up from time to time on eBay.

Doc

Followed Brian's advice and used a floppy disk cleaner disk - that helped quite a bit.  Also put a drop of oil (clock oil, not 3in1 or WD40) on the head screw gear drive and the end bearing for that gear (looks like a lag bolt).  Ran the H-89-37 Diagnostics tests and with either H-17-1 I now get within +/- .04 for rotation, seek time of 6 ms, and PASS all general tests on both drives - so that's as good as new.  So it's not the drives or the H-89-37 controller, and must be ancient media, unless there is some problem with the H-88-1 controller.

Not sure who the disk manufacture is but the Zenith media that reads/boots has the Zenith logo and label, but under the words "Hard Sector 40 Track" is a small "A".  The Zenith media that does not read/boot reliably has a small "E" there.

The only two HS disks that I can boot are the HS H-89-37 diagnostic and one minimally configured HS disk. The INIT on the HS is the old version.  There are not enough utilities on the readable SS disks to make a complete set of the updated operating system.  I have tried booting up from the SS disk and can INIT a SS disk but when I try to SYSGEN the INIT is the old version and its causing problems.  All of my operating system disks are HS and some do not read completely - I know I have all of but when read after booting up on the SS disk I can't find HDOSOVL0, 1 and other files. Again I think its the old media not reading correctly.  I always kept CAT lists with each disk and files that are on the list do not show up on the CRT display.

I think the only solution is a fresh copy of the updated OS on SS disks. Is there any way to get a copy on SS 48 TPI SS disks?

It looks like I am stuck at trying to INIT and SYSGEN new disks.

Are there step by step directions on how to make HDOS3 in the library?

Thanks again,

Rich