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The Fellowship Hall

Can a Christian believe in aliens?

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Richard W.
by :   Richard W.
Sep-18

votes :   17
Latest :   Sep-22
The poll has closed
Can a Christian believe in aliens?
Yes
   
6 votes (35%)
No
   
5 votes (29%)
Maybe
   
4 votes (24%)
Other
   
2 votes (12%)

#2 of 132

     Posted Sep-19 11:18 AM   
Tony M
 
From  Tony M  Posts 599  Last Nov-21
To  Richard W.      [Msg # 119694.2 Message 119694.2 replying to 119694.1 119694.1 ]    

Hey Richard. I take it you are speaking of aliens from another planet. I voted other because.....I believe that christian can "believe" in aliens and still be christians. But I think that that belief would be wrong.

I do not think that just because someone may believe in aliens that they are automatically not christian.  I have believed in something to find out I was wrong......but I was still saved.

Now.....Personally....I do not believe in aliens from another planet.

 

 

 

Tony

 

REVELATION 20:15

And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

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#3 of 132

     Posted Sep-19 12:34 PM   
lrschrs
 
From  lrschrs  Posts 12106  Last Nov-21
To  Richard W.      [Msg # 119694.3 Message 119694.3 replying to 119694.1 119694.1 ]    

Can a Christian beleive in aliens on other words? yes, many have.Richard Baxter, the puritan, famously wrote that we should expect the Living God who made life all oer this world to have also acted in a similiar way in all the larger cosmos.

Should we do so is another question. There we have no evidence one way or the otehr and so should have no beleif either in or in the non existance of them, it is just and only an open question.

MAYBE the various 'living creatures' around the throne in Revelation are HINTS of such beings, but the text does not TEACH us that is what is being refered to. And in one sense we can speak of both angels and demons as 'aliens' of a specific sort of nature. That is, they are not beings who were cr3eated on this earth, but are alive and sentiant, though not physical.

Science has always been divided, I suspect in modern times as whichever 'position' they have could be used to discredit Christian belief. When I was growing up the idea of aliens existing was used to discredit the idea of specuial creation, a whole universe fuull of [evolving] life meant no special action of God in creating it [not really a logical conclusion by the way]. Now it is otherwise, as the odds on a 'chance' orgiin of life are known to be so small life on other worlds really goes against the odds of it being ther by 'chance' and some have siad we live in a sterile universe and a ''god' who made such a thing would be wasteful and so not beleivible. I have even heard the same person try to have it both ways at times, without even being aware of how inconsistant they were being.

We suimply don't know how the redemptive work and word of Christ might be related to aliens. [of coruse we do know they are if they exist moral beings, because moral law is at the foundation of being itself as created]. Be we don't know if any or all are fallen either on their own race basis [as angels] or in Adam [cosmic fall, perhaps moving back s well as foreward in time, Adam's fall being indicative of the demonic falling].We simply don't know.  

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#4 of 132

     Posted Sep-19 9:57 PM   
threeinwon7
 
From  threeinwon7  Posts 4498  Last Nov-21
To  lrschrs      [Msg # 119694.4 Message 119694.4 replying to 119694.3 119694.3 ]    
>We suimply don't know how the redemptive work and word of Christ might be related to aliens.<

We DO know that if any would-be aliens are not fallen, they would serve God and proclaim Jesus Christ as the Savior if they came to this Earth.  If they are fallen, then they would deny Christ, and that is what we see with the proponents of "alien" visitors to this world. This is one more aspect of Satan's many lies and substitutes for the gospel of Jesus Christ.
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#5 of 132

     Posted Sep-20 12:05 AM   
Noelle
 
From  Noelle  Posts 453  Last Nov-21
To  Richard W.      [Msg # 119694.5 Message 119694.5 replying to 119694.1 119694.1 ]    
Richard...

My question is, what prompted you to ask this particularly odd question and polling it no less? First you posted "Aliens" and now this?
Is this the current new buzz among Catholics in your neck of the woods, or did an "alien" come and visit you? :)


Noelle
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#6 of 132

     Posted Sep-20 2:06 AM   
Richard W.
 
From  Richard W.  Posts 9504  Last Nov-21
To  Noelle      [Msg # 119694.6 Message 119694.6 replying to 119694.5 119694.5 ]    
Noelle,

<<< My question is, what prompted you to ask this particularly odd question and polling it no less? First you posted "Aliens" and now this?

I posted my question and then thought it would make an intriguing poll afterwards. Not trying to be overkill.

<<< Is this the current new buzz among Catholics in your neck of the woods, or did an "alien" come and visit you? :)

Neither. There was an article on the possibility of aliens that I referred to in the other thread, but I really think my prompting is my own interest in science fiction. Just to imagine how Christians would react maybe differently than others to the discovery of aliens, what might that say about us? Would we be afraid, or would we be attempting to communicate with them? Would we feel they were a threat to faith or another manifestation of creation? I have mulled over these questions in the past.

My own creative meanderings in science fiction are not about encountering aliens but how Christianity could evolve in a livable but uninhabited planet where everything was new and required struggle to survive on a planet that needed terraforming. How would faith survive? Would it thrive? How would it stay connected to the old world? That kind of thing.


Richard W.
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#7 of 132

     Posted Sep-21 12:52 PM   
MightyinBattle
 
From  MightyinBattle  Posts 844  Last Nov-20
To  Richard W.      [Msg # 119694.7 Message 119694.7 replying to 119694.1 119694.1 ]    

If by alien you mean people -- in the words of Curly - Why Certainly!

BUT, if you are referring to Ramolins and Klingons - they are demons!

So, my answer is all of the above!

I'm Accepted, I'm Blessed and I'm Loved by the Father!
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#8 of 132

     Posted Sep-21 1:53 PM   
cellisut
 
From  cellisut  Posts 2070  Last Nov-21
To  MightyinBattle      [Msg # 119694.8 Message 119694.8 replying to 119694.7 119694.7 ]    

>>> BUT, if you are referring to Ramolins and Klingons - they are demons! <<<

Can't Jesus save Lt. Commander Worf?

-- Clair

 

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#9 of 132

     Posted Sep-22 8:59 AM   
Noelle
 
From  Noelle  Posts 453  Last Nov-21
To  Richard W.      [Msg # 119694.9 Message 119694.9 replying to 119694.6 119694.6 ]    
R..>>Neither. There was an article on the possibility of aliens that I referred to in the other thread, but I really think my prompting is my own interest in science fiction. Just to imagine how Christians would react maybe differently than others to the discovery of aliens, what might that say about us? Would we be afraid, or would we be attempting to communicate with them? Would we feel they were a threat to faith or another manifestation of creation? I have mulled over these questions in the past.

My own creative meanderings in science fiction are not about encountering aliens but how Christianity could evolve in a livable but uninhabited planet where everything was new and required struggle to survive on a planet that needed terraforming. How would faith survive? Would it thrive? How would it stay connected to the old world? That kind of thing.<<

Richard...

In the sense of Science Fiction, it is an almost endless possibility ... <s> ... Did you ever see the film K-PAX with Kevin Spacey? If not, it's worth seeing.

For Christians, if somehow, they were to find themselves magically transported to another planet, Faith would certainly survive anywhere we find ourselves, including upon another strange planet...Since our Lord formed the entire creation, He would show man how to adapt. It is the same in real life. Odd circumstances occur, uniquely different from the last set of circumstances...So one could say in a sense, alien? It is with the same faith in Christ, that we work through a strange circumstance that the Christian would survive new terrain.<s>


Noelle



Noelle


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#10 of 132

     Posted Sep-22 1:19 PM   
MightyinBattle
 
From  MightyinBattle  Posts 844  Last Nov-20
To  cellisut      [Msg # 119694.10 Message 119694.10 replying to 119694.8 119694.8 ]    

>>> MiB:  BUT, if you are referring to Ramolins and Klingons - they are demons! <<<

>>Cellisut:  Can't Jesus save Lt. Commander Worf?<<


MiB: I'm afraid not for Lt. Commander Worf rejected Christ a long time ago.  He was kicked out of the Heaven with his Supreme High Pride Commander Lucifer along with a third of their comrades.  Seems they got way too big for their britches!  According to Revelation 20:15, if his name is not in the Book, he's going to cook!   Aliens are manifested demons.  Remember the flood in Genesis -- the demons mixed, mingled and mated with the daughters of man and God didn't put up with it for very long.  With all the glorifying of vampires, monsters and other paranormal foolishness that is being pumped into the world in movies, tv programing, books and even cartoons, the world is being primed to received satan's army in every manifestation.

WorfTNG.jpg

I'm Accepted, I'm Blessed and I'm Loved by the Father!
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#11 of 132

     Posted Sep-22 4:16 PM   
cellisut
 
From  cellisut  Posts 2070  Last Nov-21
To  MightyinBattle      [Msg # 119694.11 Message 119694.11 replying to 119694.10 119694.10 ]    

>>> MiB: I'm afraid not for Lt. Commander Worf rejected Christ a long time ago.  He was kicked out of the Heaven with his Supreme High Pride Commander Lucifer along with a third of their comrades.  <<<

Okay. Thanks for helping us keep the characters straight. I always wondered about that Worf guy with his weird forehead. How about Mr. Spock? He doesn't seem evil, just a bit socially awkward. Are those demon ears or does he have a chance of salvation?

Or, Q? He seems pretty human looking, even kind of priestly when in full dress.

-- Clair

 

 

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#12 of 132

     Posted Sep-22 4:25 PM   
Richard W.
 
From  Richard W.  Posts 9504  Last Nov-21
To  cellisut      [Msg # 119694.12 Message 119694.12 replying to 119694.11 119694.11 ]    
Clair,

<<< Or, Q? He seems pretty human looking, even kind of priestly when in full dress.

The Q Continuum is demonic. That's a given. But the rest of them are just creatures like we are. Of course they are only fictional representations of creatures that might or might not exist.

Richard W.
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#13 of 132

     Posted Sep-22 4:34 PM   
cellisut
 
From  cellisut  Posts 2070  Last Nov-21
To  Richard W.      [Msg # 119694.13 Message 119694.13 replying to 119694.12 119694.12 ]    

>>> The Q Continuum is demonic. That's a given. But the rest of them are just creatures like we are. <<<

I'm getting over my head here in Star Trek. I had to look up Q Continuum. Not sure that extra-dimensionality makes Q demonic, though he could use some humility. His powers are like a Portuguese explorer impressing some distant natives with a firearm or a looking glass - all within the realm of God's creation. Am I missing something about Q?

I agree that Worf and Spock are redeemable. I've gone to church with worse.

-- Clair

 

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#14 of 132

     Posted Sep-22 5:05 PM   
MightyinBattle
 
From  MightyinBattle  Posts 844  Last Nov-20
To  cellisut      [Msg # 119694.14 Message 119694.14 replying to 119694.11 119694.11 ]    
>>Cellisut:  Okay. Thanks for helping us keep the characters straight. I always wondered about that Worf guy with his weird forehead. How about Mr. Spock? He doesn't seem evil, just a bit socially awkward. Are those demon ears or does he have a chance of salvation?<<

MiB:  Mr. Spock is a little tricky.  It seems that he may just be one of the off springs of a those sons of God who mated with the daughters of men.  He is half human and half Vulcan.  His Vulcan demon half has been empowered with a built in stun gun , a/k/a the Vulcan Death Grip.  And, the sons of God (See Genesis 6) were super strong and Spock is ten times stronger than the strongest man.  And then there is the issue of his Vulcan New Age mind training which allows him to read and connect with man on a spiritual level.  Mr. Spock's powers do not come from on high and this presents a big problem.  This is a classic example why the Scriptures say do not be unevenly yoked.  I don't even think an exorcism would help because  that Vulcan demon is in his DNA.  So there may not be hope even for Mr. Spock!
I'm Accepted, I'm Blessed and I'm Loved by the Father!
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#15 of 132

     Posted Sep-22 8:04 PM   
lrschrs
 
From  lrschrs  Posts 12106  Last Nov-21
To  MightyinBattle      [Msg # 119694.15 Message 119694.15 replying to 119694.10 119694.10 ]    

I see no biblical grounds for sayign physicla aliens, if they existed, would be manifested demons. The logic does not fit here.

Because some current claims of alien contqact MAY be domioncly induced it does not follow that any and all such contact is that. Because some Irish people are reported to like butter brickel ice cream it does not follow that all of them actually do so. because some dogs may be wolfhounds it does nto follw that all dogss are. because some REPORTS of aliens MAY be domonic in origin it does nto follwo that even all of these are due to demonic action, much less that any physical ones,if they exist, are such.

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#16 of 132

     Posted Sep-22 10:01 PM   
MightyinBattle
 
From  MightyinBattle  Posts 844  Last Nov-20
To  lrschrs      [Msg # 119694.16 Message 119694.16 replying to 119694.15 119694.15 ]    

>>Irschrs:  I see no biblical grounds for sayign physicla aliens, if they existed, would be manifested demons. The logic does not fit here.

Because some current claims of alien contqact MAY be domioncly induced it does not follow that any and all such contact is that. Because some Irish people are reported to like butter brickel ice cream it does not follow that all of them actually do so. because some dogs may be wolfhounds it does nto follw that all dogss are. because some REPORTS of aliens MAY be domonic in origin it does nto follwo that even all of these are due to demonic action, much less that any physical ones,if they exist, are such.<<


MiB:  Genesis 6:1-7 and Job 1: 6-7 backs up my contentions.   Just what or who were the sons of God? Job 1:6 says they presented themselves before the Lord in heaven and satan was with them.  In Job there seems to have been a mixture of the heavenly host -- good and evil.  However, in Genesis 6 there is a clear distinction made between the sons of God, man and the daughters of men.

Just how did they differ from man and the daughters of men?  They differed because man and the daughters were human and the sons of God with fallen angels a/k/a demons -- being not of this earth.  They were none other than satan's demons who got with the daughters of men in an attempt to usurp God's plan of salvation through corrupting the seed of Eve a/k/a the woman Mary.  The Almighty God stopped satan's plan.  Man died in this round in the flood (except Noah and his family) but the demons, a/k/a sons of God did not drown but were cast into a dry place.  See, Luke 11:4.

I might have been messing around applying the Scriptures to Star Trek characters, however, my contentions are based on biblical fact.  If Mr. Spock were real, the human part of him would be destroyed and the Vulcan part would be cast into a dry place.    I've added emphases in pink. 

Genesis 6:1-7: " 1 Now it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born to them, 2 that the sons of God saw the daughters of men, that they were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves of all whom they chose. 3 And the LORD said, “My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; yet his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.” 4 There were giants on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown.  5 Then the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 And the LORD was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. 7 So the LORD said, “I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth, both man and beast, creeping thing and birds of the air, for I am sorry that I have made them.”

Job 1:6-7 "6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them. 7 And the LORD said to Satan, “From where do you come?” So Satan answered the LORD and said, “From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking back and forth on it.”

Luke 11:4 '"When an unclean spirit goes out of a man, he goes through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he says, ‘I will return to my house from which I came.’"

If it is not of this earth and it is walking, talking, breathing, eating, etc. it is an angel -- either good or evil.  Good angels of are God's messengers and helpers.  Evil angels are satan's evil spirits.

Now, Christopher, show the Scriptures to back up your contentions above.  I have no idea what you are trying to say, other than me right -- you wrong. 
I'm Accepted, I'm Blessed and I'm Loved by the Father!
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#17 of 132

     Posted Sep-23 3:00 PM   
lrschrs
 
From  lrschrs  Posts 12106  Last Nov-21
To  MightyinBattle      [Msg # 119694.17 Message 119694.17 replying to 119694.16 119694.16 ]    

A better reading of the references in Genesis 6:1-7 are that they refer to men, either hwo are Godly [sons of God, saved people, or at least in coveantn with God] and sinenrs, men who reject God and His covenant. The passage simply refers to MEN of two ETHICAL sorts who mingeled without the needed ethicla seperation from sin the Godly are to display, resolting, as often the case, in sin becoming what defines the whole bunch.

Job 1:6-7 uses 'sons of God' here for angels, nto men who have that sort of relationship. The place is in heaven, not on earth. We do know the devil, and his minions, can be present to the earth, but here only the devil is represented is being permitted to make a bad case in the 'heavenly court'.

Neither passage is about aliens, the first is about men as men, here on earth, not demons of demi-men capable of sexual acts with humans [angels have no real gender and so as individual creations cannot procreate at all with anyone or anything]. The seocnd is outside of this cosmon completely. So neither passage has one word to say about the issue.

The bible simply does not tell us if any such creatures, not demons or angels, but fellow creatures with bodies, exist or don't exist. Some apply passages about the living creatures in heaven around the throne as POSSIBLE references to such creatures who had been saved and so exaulted as men will be to eternal life, this MAY be ahint of such, but is not proof itself, as they may simply represent the fullness of divien glory displayed in the universe reflected int eh glory throne's form as described to us. it is enough of a hint to tell us thae existance of aliens is not UNbiblical, but not enough to demonstrate they do exist. Anotehr line of evidence is that God displays His glroy in all creation, and one of His greatest creation displays of that is life. 'let all His creatues praise Him!'. Again, not proof, but something that excludes us from saying they CAN'T be there.   

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#18 of 132

     Posted Sep-23 9:38 PM   
MightyinBattle
 
From  MightyinBattle  Posts 844  Last Nov-20
To  lrschrs      [Msg # 119694.18 Message 119694.18 replying to 119694.17 119694.17 ]    
>>Chris:  Neither passage is about aliens, the first is about men as men, here on earth, not demons of demi-men capable of sexual acts with humans [angels have no real gender and so as individual creations cannot procreate at all with anyone or anything]. The seocnd is outside of this cosmon completely. So neither passage has one word to say about the issue.<<

MiB:  Just what I thought, you have no scripture to back up your opinions.   Genesis 6:1-2 clearly makes a distinction between the sons of God (also see Job 1:6), the men and their daughters.  If it they were just different men marrying the daughters of men as you contend and as stated in verse 2, why did God immediately  pronounce a death sentence on everybody but Noah (see v. 3) of 120 years?  Furthermore, according to Strong's the Hebrew word used for giant in verse 4 is Nephilim #5303 is from the root word Naphal #5307 meaning fallen ones.

Here is Genesis 6:1-4 again   "1
And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, 2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. 3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. 4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown."

If God didn't present it to Adam to name, be it human, animal, bug, fish, bird -- it is not of this world.  And if it is not of this world and it is walking and talking it is an angel -- either good or evil.  Aliens in the context of this thread are living beings not of this earth and there is no reference or explanation in the Bible for it other than angels -- either good ones or evil ones.  My explanation makes more sense than your unsubstantiated declaration -- me right, you wrong -- why because I said so.

If it materializes out of thin air and says I'm a Nephilim or  a Klingon, it be a demon!   Ephesians 6:12 declares " we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, powers and the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.  Just where are these high places?
(epouranios Strongs #2032 -- above the sky -- celestial Just what is in the realm of the supernatural?  If something materializes you better start running and praying for God's mercy!

Speaking of running and crying out for God's mercy, a man testified in church that he was being chased by some guys with guns.  He was trying to pray Psalm 91 but couldn't formulate his thoughts.  All he could think was Lord, feathers! feather! feathers!, which translated Psalm 91:3-4 "4
He shall cover thee with his feathers, and under his wings shalt thou trust: his truth shall be thy shield and buckler. 5 Thou shalt not be afraid for the terror by night; nor the arrow that flieth by day. . ."  The Lord hid him that day, he does not know how else he got away.


 

I'm Accepted, I'm Blessed and I'm Loved by the Father!
Edited Sep-23   by  MightyinBattle

Edited Sep-23   by  MightyinBattle
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#19 of 132

     Posted Sep-24 12:33 PM   
lrschrs
 
From  lrschrs  Posts 12106  Last Nov-21
To  MightyinBattle      [Msg # 119694.19 Message 119694.19 replying to 119694.18 119694.18 ]    

First, 'fallen oens' describes all men, as all are fallen in Adam. In this case there is no real conenction between the use of 'sons of God' in Genesis and Job, the subject matter is different completely. The fact that the same term is used does not mean the same thign is being indicated. Meaning is determined by context, not decoding.

Genesis 6:1-3 tells us in verse 3 God is speaking of MEN, not angels and men. "My Spirit will not strive with men forever". Men, refering back to the sons of God and daughterts of [sinful] men are indeed flesh, and thus their life nature is to be limited by that fact. They are not ocmbinations of some angelic/demionic stuff here, but men of flesh.

6:4. the giants then, as they continued, were MEN who were mighty and valourous men. Thus whatever the giants were they REMAINED present [...and also afterwards...] and active even until at least the time of Moses.

 6:5-7. So God judged men here. So the judgment fell not on some other rwace of beings, but on men, which included some men who were compromised and sinful members of the covenant community [sons of God] as well as open sinners [daughters of men].

The passage simply does not support the whole Jewish myth of demon beings and the like, 1 Tim. 1:4, 4:7.  

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#20 of 132

     Posted Sep-24 2:15 PM   
MightyinBattle
 
From  MightyinBattle  Posts 844  Last Nov-20
To  lrschrs      [Msg # 119694.20 Message 119694.20 replying to 119694.19 119694.19 ]    
>>Chris: First, 'fallen oens' describes all men, as all are fallen in Adam.<<

MiB:  Only problem is the Hebrew word for these giants -- fallen one -- reflects that they fell from above.   They stepped down out of their natural place to mix with the daughters of men.  Satan's plan was to corrupt the seed of the woman, so that God could not bring forth salvation through His son Jesus through the woman.  This is elementary teaching of Genesis.  These giants were not the same as Adam, the Hebrew word  for man who God placed on this earth and who disobeyed God in the garden.  God's punishment for satan for his part in Eve's deception and Adam's disobedience was a promise to bring enmity between satan and Eve's seed.  satan attempted to circumvent the salvation of man, just as he is doing today, for many died in the flood and satan continued on and many will men will die separated from God and be destroyed because of satan.   But next time as you know, satan will be done away with once and for all.  I can hardly wait!  The giants in Genesis 6 were fallen angels.

Present a Scripture where the sons of God are referred to as men.



I'm Accepted, I'm Blessed and I'm Loved by the Father!
Edited Sep-24   by  MightyinBattle
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