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Message Area
Social Issues

Catholic Church Punishes Patrick Kennedy

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#1 of 318

     Posted Nov-22 4:53 PM   
Tobster E [Wizoptress]
 
From  Tobster E [Wizoptress]  Posts 7201  Last Feb-8
To  All      [Msg # 148118.1 ]    

Congressman Patrick Kennedy has been punished by the Roman Catholic Church for not voting for a amendment to the Health Insurance Bill commonly called the Stupek Amendment. My question is, what right does the Roman Catholic Church have to punish a Member of Congress for his actions as a Member of Congress? Kennedy, the son of the late Senator Edward Kennedy has been barred from receiving Communion.

Does the Church have the right to interfere in the actions of the State? Are they out of line here?

Should Kennedy be forced to vote the way his Church orders? Does this mean that any Catholic serving in Congress or the Supreme Court will be forced to do as the Bishops instruct? What does this say about the Church’s respect for the separation of Church and State?

http://news.aol.com/article/patrick-kennedy-denied-communion-from/765365

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#2 of 318

     Posted Nov-23 2:37 PM   
BigCATguy
 
From  BigCATguy  Posts 5378  Last 4:15 AM
To  Tobster E [Wizoptress]      [Msg # 148118.2 Message 148118.2 replying to 148118.1 148118.1 ]    

Time to take away their tax exemption. Should have been done a long, long, long time ago for all churches.

 

"In this world of sin and sorrow, there is always something to be thankful for; as for me, I rejoice that I am not a Republican."

--H.L. Mencken

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#3 of 318

     Posted Nov-23 4:58 PM   
Tobster E [Wizoptress]
 
From  Tobster E [Wizoptress]  Posts 7201  Last Feb-8
To  BigCATguy      [Msg # 148118.3 Message 148118.3 replying to 148118.2 148118.2 ]    

30% of the Congress are Catholic, and now we have to worry whether they will be allowed to vote their Districts or States without being punished by the Catholic Church. This is scary.

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#4 of 318

     Posted Nov-24 9:29 AM   
KeithEdgerly
 
From  KeithEdgerly  Posts 3013  Last 12:18 PM
To  Tobster E [Wizoptress]      [Msg # 148118.4 Message 148118.4 replying to 148118.1 148118.1 ]    

<<<My question is, what right does the Roman Catholic Church have to punish a Member of Congress for his actions as a Member of Congress? Kennedy, the son of the late Senator Edward Kennedy has been barred from receiving Communion.>

Putting someone in jail or subjecting them to cruelty or death is punishment, merely refusing to administer religious rituals is not punishment. Millions of former Roman Catholics, myself included, might of rights be refused communion if we bulled our way into the sanctuary to demand it be given to us. What does Patrick Kennedy have to say about this? I wonder if he is nearly so adamant about this as those of us you who are not catholic at all (and who never were) seem to be?

If Patrick Kennedy is behind every bit of this I would gladly stand alongside him, I will withdraw my criticism, I would be fighting for my rights as well as his, but unless it is shown to be the case that Congressman Patrick Kennedy supports all this, my criticism stands.

Keith

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#5 of 318

     Posted Nov-24 3:48 PM   
BigCATguy
 
From  BigCATguy  Posts 5378  Last 4:15 AM
To  Tobster E [Wizoptress]      [Msg # 148118.5 Message 148118.5 replying to 148118.3 148118.3 ]    

Hope you caught Chris Mathews pretty much destroying Bishop Thomas Tobin on Hardball last night.

 

"In this world of sin and sorrow, there is always something to be thankful for; as for me, I rejoice that I am not a Republican."

--H.L. Mencken

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#6 of 318

     Posted Nov-24 3:50 PM   
BigCATguy
 
From  BigCATguy  Posts 5378  Last 4:15 AM
To  KeithEdgerly      [Msg # 148118.6 Message 148118.6 replying to 148118.4 148118.4 ]    

<<If Patrick Kennedy is behind every bit of this I would gladly stand alongside him, I will withdraw my criticism, I would be fighting for my rights as well as his, but unless it is shown to be the case that Congressman Patrick Kennedy supports all this, my criticism stands.>>

Supports all what? Do you ever engage your brain before your mouth?

 

 

"In this world of sin and sorrow, there is always something to be thankful for; as for me, I rejoice that I am not a Republican."

--H.L. Mencken

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#7 of 318

     Posted Nov-24 4:56 PM   
Tobster E [Wizoptress]
 
From  Tobster E [Wizoptress]  Posts 7201  Last Feb-8
To  KeithEdgerly      [Msg # 148118.7 Message 148118.7 replying to 148118.4 148118.4 ]    

>>If Patrick Kennedy is behind every bit of this I would gladly stand alongside him, I will withdraw my criticism, I would be fighting for my rights as well as his, but unless it is shown to be the case that Congressman Patrick Kennedy supports all this, my criticism stands.<<

Actually, Pat is the one who blew the whistle on this. What concerns me is the attempt by the Catholic Church to control the votes of their members.

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#8 of 318

     Posted Nov-24 4:56 PM   
Tobster E [Wizoptress]
 
From  Tobster E [Wizoptress]  Posts 7201  Last Feb-8
To  BigCATguy      [Msg # 148118.8 Message 148118.8 replying to 148118.5 148118.5 ]    

I was teaching when it was on. Was it good?

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#9 of 318

     Posted Nov-24 4:57 PM   
Tobster E [Wizoptress]
 
From  Tobster E [Wizoptress]  Posts 7201  Last Feb-8
To  BigCATguy      [Msg # 148118.9 Message 148118.9 replying to 148118.6 148118.6 ]    

Cat,
Drop it.

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#10 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 8:39 AM   
KeithEdgerly
 
From  KeithEdgerly  Posts 3013  Last 12:18 PM
To  BigCATguy      [Msg # 148118.10 Message 148118.10 replying to 148118.6 148118.6 ]    

<<<Supports all what?>

All this animus directed against the Roman Catholic Church and no one else.

Keith

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#11 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 8:58 AM   
KeithEdgerly
 
From  KeithEdgerly  Posts 3013  Last 12:18 PM
To  Tobster E [Wizoptress]      [Msg # 148118.11 Message 148118.11 replying to 148118.7 148118.7 ]    

<<<Actually, Pat is the one who blew the whistle on this.>

Oh, I don't doubt that. I would be interested in what (if anything) he thinks should be done about it.

Keith

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#12 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 11:20 AM   
Tobster E [Wizoptress]
 
From  Tobster E [Wizoptress]  Posts 7201  Last Feb-8
To  KeithEdgerly      [Msg # 148118.12 Message 148118.12 replying to 148118.10 148118.10 ]    

It is against the Catholic Bishops, I don’t see any other religion in this country punishing people for voting their beliefs. Catholics can do what they want as far as I am concerned, but when Congressmen are punished for their votes in Congress someone has crossed the line, and it is the Bishops.

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#13 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 11:24 AM   
Tobster E [Wizoptress]
 
From  Tobster E [Wizoptress]  Posts 7201  Last Feb-8
To  KeithEdgerly      [Msg # 148118.13 Message 148118.13 replying to 148118.11 148118.11 ]    

>>Oh, I don't doubt that. I would be interested in what (if anything) he thinks should be done about it.<<’

I am sure that he wants the Bishops to back off on this. They really don’t have the right to tell him how to vote. I am not anti Catholic, my Senator McCaskill is Catholic and has been punished here for being pro choice. Now, if I want to vote for a Catholic do I have to take a second look and look if they have the courage to stand against their Church? That is really putting people in a bad position. This country has a separation of Church and State, and it is my opinion that the Bishops have crossed the line. I am not happy about it.

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#14 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 3:59 PM   
BigCATguy
 
From  BigCATguy  Posts 5378  Last 4:15 AM
To  Tobster E [Wizoptress]      [Msg # 148118.14 Message 148118.14 replying to 148118.8 148118.8 ]    

<<I was teaching when it was on. Was it good?>>

Total annihilation!

BTW,do you not have a TIVO or comparable device that enables you to record programming?

"In this world of sin and sorrow, there is always something to be thankful for; as for me, I rejoice that I am not a Republican."

--H.L. Mencken

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#15 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 4:03 PM   
BigCATguy
 
From  BigCATguy  Posts 5378  Last 4:15 AM
To  Tobster E [Wizoptress]      [Msg # 148118.15 Message 148118.15 replying to 148118.12 148118.12 ]    

<<Catholics can do what they want as far as I am concerned, but when Congressmen are punished for their votes in Congress someone has crossed the line, and it is the Bishops.>>

I'm a little surprised they were able to take time off from molesting children. In a very peverse way, that's rather impressive.

"In this world of sin and sorrow, there is always something to be thankful for; as for me, I rejoice that I am not a Republican."

--H.L. Mencken

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#16 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 4:05 PM   
Tobster E [Wizoptress]
 
From  Tobster E [Wizoptress]  Posts 7201  Last Feb-8
To  BigCATguy      [Msg # 148118.16 Message 148118.16 replying to 148118.14 148118.14 ]    

>>BTW,do you not have a TIVO or comparable device that enables you to record programming?<<

Yeah, we do, but I usually don’t bother. I am trying now to break the TV habit. Usually when I am online, I have MSNBC going, but the TV is off this time. I have had enough.

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#17 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 4:08 PM   
Tobster E [Wizoptress]
 
From  Tobster E [Wizoptress]  Posts 7201  Last Feb-8
To  BigCATguy      [Msg # 148118.17 Message 148118.17 replying to 148118.15 148118.15 ]    

>>I'm a little surprised they were able to take time off from molesting children. In a very peverse way, that's rather impressive.<<

I really don’t want to go there. There was another settlement because of Priest abuse, and this one was in Ireland where they had run a series of “Reform Schools”

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#18 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 5:24 PM   
Tony
 
From  Tony  Posts 10147  Last 5:15 AM
To  Tobster E [Wizoptress]      [Msg # 148118.18 Message 148118.18 replying to 148118.1 148118.1 ]    

Should Kennedy be forced to vote the way his Church orders? Does this mean that any Catholic serving in Congress or the Supreme Court will be forced to do as the Bishops instruct? What does this say about the Church’s respect for the separation of Church and State?<<

The late, great Senator Ted Kennedy was barred from receiving Holy Communion for some similar papist faux pas, and this after Bishop Lester the Molester heard his confession. Who knows what they put in those wafers, anyway. It's hard to believe that I once was an altarboy, studied to be a Catholic priest, and was called Brother Anthony; who better to know what tht authoritarian, patriarchal Roman Church is really all about?

Tony

"The Democrats have moved to the right, and the Republicans have moved to a mental hospital." Bill Maher.

Edited Nov-25   by  Tony
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#19 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 5:30 PM   
Tony
 
From  Tony  Posts 10147  Last 5:15 AM
To  BigCATguy      [Msg # 148118.19 Message 148118.19 replying to 148118.2 148118.2 ]    

Time to take away their tax exemption. Should have been done a long, long, long time ago for all churches.<<

I'd like to see an exemption the good works they do, That, of course, would wouldn't help the Roman church, they don't do anything that is good for anyone but the Catholic Church, besides trying to dictate Caesar's job in every country they go.

Have a great Turkey Day, brother, and help Linda cook, or at least load up the dishwasher. :)

Tony

"The Democrats have moved to the right, and the Republicans have moved to a mental hospital." Bill Maher.
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#20 of 318

     Posted Nov-25 5:51 PM   
Tony
 
From  Tony  Posts 10147  Last 5:15 AM
To  KeithEdgerly      [Msg # 148118.20 Message 148118.20 replying to 148118.4 148118.4 ]    

Putting someone in jail or subjecting them to cruelty or death is punishment, merely refusing to administer religious rituals is not punishment. Millions of former Roman Catholics, myself included, might of rights be refused communion if we bulled our way into the sanctuary to demand it be given to us. What does Patrick Kennedy have to say about this? I wonder if he is nearly so adamant about this as those of us you who are not catholic at all (and who never were) seem to be?

If Patrick Kennedy is behind every bit of this I would gladly stand alongside him, I will withdraw my criticism, I would be fighting for my rights as well as his, but unless it is shown to be the case that Congressman Patrick Kennedy supports all this, my criticism stands.<<

My goodness, Keith, what are you going on about. Supports all of what? Hell, I don't doubt Patrick Kennedy didn't even mention it. The Catholic Church likes to leak that sort of sh*t  to the press themselves, in the hopes it might embarass Kennedy. Fortunately, I don't confess to anyone, anywhere, so I won't tell you what I would say if some pedophile in a black dress told me what I could or couldn't do.

Apparently, you are no Catholic, because those who believe, especially those in the public limelight, would take it as a rather huge, and offensive insult, intended to influence the Catholic vote. Rhode Island is a Catholic state, however it is number one in the number of abortions done every year.  Catholics don't really listen to the Pope, or the Bishop when it affects something they want to do. Like most hypocrites, they listen with dutiful Catholic outrage only when it affects others, just like they did when the Bishop threatened a couple of weeks ago to refuse rites to any legislator in Rhode Island who voted to accept gay marriages from Massachussetts. I think Catholics and Republicans are going to want to avoid me on the day I die. :)

Tony

"The Democrats have moved to the right, and the Republicans have moved to a mental hospital." Bill Maher.
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