Value Liberty? - Thank a VetCheers, Jerry
What it means to me to be a Veteran:
1. Memories of exotic lands and good friends who shared special experiences.
2. Chills that run up my spine when I hear the National Anthem played.
3. Still knowing how to stand at attention when reciting the Pledge of Allegiance.
4. Remembering how to 'field strip' a cigarette (even though I stopped smoking years ago)
5. Remembering the cold of a German winter and the heat of a Vietnamese day.
6. Remembering how good it felt to wash your feet and change into clean, soft socks.
7. Not being there to see your kids grow up - long separations from family - moving every three years, at least.
8. No sleep for days at a time yet still being able to function.
9. A paycheck form Uncle Sam every month 'til the day I die, free medical care to push that event as far into the future as possible, being able to shop at the commissary and the PX after presenting a valid ID card at the post gate.
10. Full sets of various uniforms that I can no longer fit into.
It was a great trip and I would not trade any moment of it for anything in the world!!
Jerry
Of course the friends, some we see now and some we will never see again.
The way the post comes to a complete standstill when the retreat canon goes off and all the cars stop and the occupants get out.
The travel to and from ports of arrival/departure, either by bus, train or auto. I very seldom flew.
Just today me and two other vets were discussing the boat trips overseas on troop carriers living in troop class conditions. That was probably the worse travel in the world, plus being sea sick for days.
Seeing Europe, Asia and other places like a resident and not like a tourist.
No matter where you went, including field exercises there was always a barber.
Camping out at night when it was cold and damp. I used to take my boots inside the sleeping bag.
Meeting my wife and staying married to her for over 32 years.
The famous words from the top kick on friday afternoon, "see me first thing monday morning" nothing but worry all weekend.
The smell of Hot Stew from the mess hall on winter nights returning for chow in Korea in the 50's.
Plenty more and those guys discussing Chicago in another thread, my best assignment at Fort Sheridan Illinois.
AFRTS in RVN showing episodes of Star Trek.
The list could go on forever.
John
Hi Jerry:
On Veterans Day I remember the men that I was close to during the time I spent with A Company 168th Infantry 34th Division some 60 years ago. Mostly I remember the following men.
Pfc William Boggs Lt John Bittner
Pvt Barney Cole Capt William Galt
Pfc George Houston Sgt Ludwig Kubisch
Sgt Charles Lee Sgt Bob Newland
Capt Norman Yando
All these members of A Company were killed during combat in Italy. These men were all my buddies, yes even the officers, even though I was a Pfc. What made them special to me was that I was within several feet to most of them when they were killed. I don't know why I escaped but I thank God every day.
By the way, Captain Galt received the Medal of Honor for his actions at Villa Corcetta just South of Rome.
I have been able to visit the graves of most of these men who are buried in the U.S. Military Cemetery in Florence Italy. I believe that their lives were not lost in vain. Those of us that survived did what we could to make this country better for our children. No matter how bad things seem to be for the U.S. today I am sure we will persevere.
Bob
Jerry, and all the rest of you good guys out there... having served in the Air Force is like having served in no other military outfit: we didn't (and still don't) travel as complete units, usually moving from one assignment to another as one man/woman. You guys who were Army, Navy, Coast Guard....what-have-you: you all traveled and stayed together as a unit, more or less and were able to keep friendships through the years. It's a little different with the fly-boys; it really took some doing, keeping track of friendships. Sometimes addresses were lost during reassignments; lots of times, when a guy cleans up his area for inspection, things have a way of getting "misplaced"; valuable addresses, etc.
What I'm trying to say here, guys, is that I still "see" in front of me, the faces of the guys I served with in Korea: we were scared youngsters, damned right we were, even though we were mostly rear echelon, repairing machines, hauling bombs and ammo, standing guard duty, driving the mail truck for the troops up the line. Those faces will be etched in my memory, even though the names have long since escaped me. Yes, it's different, being a so-called fly-boy.
I guess what I really want to say here, is that I honor and respect the real veterans, those who have sacrificed so damn much, including their lives and fortunes, in order that we might be here tonight, remembering their valorous deeds, giving their all, for future generations of us, even for those who don't appreciate a damn thing that was sacrificed for them.
We attended a Veterans Day parade today, and it was definitely an honor to stand in the presence of yesterday's and today's veterans; to salute the colors as individual units passed in review....even in the presence of dumb, fat-assed baby boomer pigs who refused to stand still when the Colors passed, much less salute the colors. Perhaps they were "expressing" their rights: yeah, RIGHT!
Anyway, good friends, honoring Veterans Day to me means expressing my gratitude and deepest appreciation to all who have unselfishly given of themselves, sacrificed everything, placed it all on the line....for the sake of their fellow American citizens' freedom and liberty.
Thanks for giving me this opportunity to express myself!
The best of everything to you all!
Herb
The Old Post
Roads still go to places that are not, Memories direct the wheel, though I've forgot What names the streets once had, my body knows Which turns to take, where stood the rows Of barracks, old and white by then, a sight To thousands now gone on, and we who too Passed through this place, where day and night Our country's duty trained and winnowed its young men, Old now, who come here yet again.
Memories turn the wheel, The road ends short upon a grassy field Where once I stood with others, freedom's shield Or so we thought when we were young. The Generals stood there upon a platform hung With brave, bright bunting, red and blue, EYES, RIGHT! -- We marched past in review, Spitshined and pressed, all honor due Our Nation's Colors, then as ever was; To serve, we thought, was surely a just cause.
Here stands the concrete that is all Of where we fed -- the old mess hall Where countless pots and pans we scrubbed; The kitchen clean, floors waxed and rubbed Twice every day and at the end, Someone would do it all again! What's left? Foundations trace where men In their platoons would live; Where once we stood with lockers on the side Inspection! Beds and blankets tight, Creased uniforms and name tags done just SO; Demerits if all did not go As Sergeants ordered us to show.
Memories turn the wheel, Memories of wood and steel. Once we shared as brothers would, back then, Once we thought as angels would, to bend Fate to our will and live forever, friends; Some dead in war, and time and age take no account of good Or bad. Old soldiers never die! A lie. Our ranks are thinner far than those who stood In companies with guidons in review. (As once our Fathers did, who now are few.) Our sons will not disturb the grass, Not now. Perhaps as they may pass, On some two lane and ill named highway Think, that here, their fathers served to keep them free. Now turn the wheel, and drive; you know the way From memory.
Copyright Cortland E. Richmond
Veteran’s Day Parade
We formed up behind the banner,
And the colors raised high and proud,
Joking and talking about it,
As we marched and we waved at the crowd.
There were children strapped into their strollers,
Waving just like they saw Mommy do,
And I wondered how many would march in their time
Down the streets we were passing through.
And I found myself seeing the Marines who stood
So young and so tall in the park,
With weapons in desperate fighting
As they killed and they died in the dark.
And I found myself seeing the children
Who have no way to know what it means,
Gray and wise as they parade down roads yet to come
For defending our nation’s dreams.
And defending our nation’s dreams.
© Cortland Richmond 2003
Archie
///This year is a sad time -- considering some so called Veterans let others trash someone who served his country and decided to run for president???
I have no problem with kerry's service in Vietnam, my problem with him is what he said and did upon his return to CONUS.
There has not been a week gone by in the last 40 years of my life where I did not dream of someone who was killed in front of me. For 30 + years I blamed Kerry and the liberals for me being angry.I suffered lost innocent youth. No macho statements about whether the Vietnam war was a good war is going to change this fact -- my young friends are still in their graves with broken bones.
What really bothers me is those who have never been to war judge those who have been in the middle of heavy combat. The old Veterans Administration did this for years! As for the statement from those in the Swift Boat so called veterans for truth were in deeper draft boats made to patrol the ocean. According to a friend who patrolled the rivers in flat bottomed boats ----- swift boats never saw much combat compared to those old flat bottomed converted landing craft. See how stupid it is when we judge others when we were not there!
The only thing good about the Vietnam war as I see it was it created heroes in their personal life after coming home and using their maturity raising children, paying taxes and being good citizens. Who cares what Jane Fond did? Who cares what Kerry said as a kid after seeing war? The war is in the past and lets keep it there. PS.Let those suffering from bad memories get to the VA and get help.
/// Who cares what Jane Fond did? Who cares what Kerry said as a kid after seeing war? The war is in the past and lets keep it there. ////
A lot of former POW's do care about what was said and by who when they were locked up. A lot were locked up for 6,7 even 8 years. Some are probably still locked up or killed so North Vietnam could save face and being there you know what saving face means to the Vietnamese and practically all Asians.
The war certainly is past and should be forgotten and most Vietnam vets would like to do so. I think john kerry opened up the door in July 2004 at the democrat convention when he said "john kerry reporting for duty" and then all the talking heads popped up with war hero this and war hero that. As I said I do not question his silver and bronze stars. I do have a little problem with the purple hearts. I know a guy who got a purple heart falling off a bar stool.
We must also think that the swift boat people are Vietnam vets also. They have a story to tell and some of them are telling a different story than john kerry is telling.
I admit I know little about the navy boat operations. Who should I believe the swift boat people or the kerry talking heads. Its a hard decision.
My feelings about john kerry would be different if he didn't say all those nasty things. Remember he might have been young but he had a Yale education and was a naval officer and should have known better.
In closing I just want to say something I really believe in my heart and soul. john kerrys action and remarks made by him after his return to CONUS to me was the same as spitting on the graves of the 55 thousand plus who never returned.
I am not a fan of GWB. I do believe GWB did the right things since 9-11 and I do believe the country to include your and my grandkids will be safer.
RE> ///This year is a sad time -- considering some so called Veterans let others trash someone who served his country and decided to run for president???
ANS> I have to agree. My father is WW2 USN veteran of Philippines, Okinawa, etc. and has always voted straight Democrat all his life. Including this election. But the testimony to Congress even got to him. And as James Webb stated in an editorial months before the elections nailing both Bush and Kerry, why couldn't Kerry just say he was bitter and just apologize?? Finally, the weekend before Thanksgiving I am taking my father to see the new WW2 National Memorial in Washington, DC. He is in his 80s and really wants to see it. I will try and post a bunch of photos when I get back.
BTW> John, Let's go back to disagreeing all the time. Ok?
Best Jack
NOTE> ARCHIE. John is being truthful. He doesn't support Kerry but he never went along with those groups condemning him for his war service. Only for what he said and done after he returned.
RE> Frankly I am sick of hearing about POW's and how they suffered Many GIs suffered in that war. Many suffered in all wars including POW's.
ANS> I wish you would rethink the above statement. I think if you will reflect on it you will see what I mean.
Respectfully Jack E. Hammond
Listen I am a grunt. I saw people die. I worked as a service officer for a large Veterans organizations after the war. I saw veterans suffer a lot. I ONCE HAD THE "VA" TELL THIS MEXICAN SURVIVOR OF THE BATTAN DEATH MARCH HIS PROBLEM WAS HE NEVER HELD A NORMAL JOB, WHEN HE ASKED FOR HELP. -- A CHOSIN RESERVOIR SURVIVORS WITH NUBS AT THE END OF THEIR FEET.
American Vietnamese WAR PRISONERS WERE APPLAUDED AND LOVED AND GIVEN JOBS WHEN THEY RETURNED. mODST gi'S WERE CONSIDERED DEAD BEATS. Most combat veterans never retired from the military they had to make it on their own.
Dear Archie,
I wish to thank you for your service to our nation. But on this we will have to agree to disagree.
Respectfully yours,Jack E. Hammond
Dear Jack:
I offended many on this forum with my statement about Vietnam’s American Prisoners of War suffering. My point is not to pour scorn on these war heroes, but to put some balance on the sufferings in war done by all front line soldiers sailors and Marines.
To try to put some perspective on what I was saying. Most of these POW’s were pilots. Therefore they were older and had university degrees, better able to cope with what they were going through. Yes they suffered as prisoners of war. But they were welcomed back into the United States with warm hugs. SinceThey were welcomed home they did not have to suffer the humiliation of being a plain old combat vet who was an uneducated 20 years old, and trying to work on what he should do in life. This in the midst of war demonstrations, and all that encumbered for these poor souls.
As for the story about the Bataan Death March survivor being indirectly told because he came from a sociological deprived Mexican background , no work ethic, and no long term job is the reason for his unhappiness . This same story can be told hundreds of times about different veterans to various degrees, in many American wars. I said and am saying American Vietnam Prisoner’s of War did not suffer and still do not have to suffer this embarrassment.
The vast majority of America’s war heroes were in the military for only a short time. Compared to career military people who seem to want at times want to claim themselves as the only pure veteran.
The myth is if you served in Vietnam for 5 tours somehow you are more of a Veteran. This has given John Q public the image that someone who served only three months and was wounded evacuated somehow is not as good a veteran. Do not sneer at this statement someone who has no idea of war and is more interested in “Brittany Spears” thinks like this. The immeasurable majority of our war dead in Vietnam did not carry out a year “in country.” nor do those veterans walking on one limbs with shrapnel in their muscles forty years after it was put there.
As for “Jane Fonda” I have never seen any of her movies “Honestly this is true. But in equal disdain I hold those in the United States that some how the war was for a good cause, and those poor drafted Army bastards who served in the Big Red One or the 9th Infantry in Mekong river delta were dead beats on returning to the US.
Respectfully Disagreeing
Archie C. Haase
/////Frankly I am sick of hearing about POW's and how they suffered Many GIs suffered in that war. Many suffered in all wars including POW'////
Many did suffer, however in most cases the GI's suffered for a year and went home. Some went home sooner minus a part of there body. Some went home to loving wives, loved ones and friends to get there lives back together, however when a person taken prisoner was locked up no one knew what there future would be. Some are still present and UNACCOUNTED for. They had some long tours of duty, some stayed for 6, 7 and even 8 years.
You could write and receive mail from your loved ones, the POW's received nothing and there loved ones knew nothing.
You could be at base camp and enjoy a beer at times, the POWs were paraded through the streets and stoned, spat at and called names along with being threatened.
I don't care what kind of situation you were in or how hard you had it, the POW's had it the worse. When I look back now, I rfealize that ar times I was in good shape. The POWs were NEVER in good shape.
Last year a neighbor of mine died. He was a POW in WW2 in Germany. He told me about the camp and even though germany followed the Geneva Convention most of the time, he said it was horrible. Now look at the Vietnam POWs and remember the Hanoi government followed there own rules and put yourself in there shoes.
Sure we had it bad at times, but on the whole we still have a sound mind.
How about the POWs in Korea. That is another story.
